These eggs freak me out every time!!!

[CarpetPythons.com.au]

JasonL: "only the strongest survive process", take this away and your weakening the hobby to line your pockets. Thats not a fair statement to make. Albinos are not weak. I have seen no difference in their maintenance compared to their wild type counterparts.

 

[CodeRed]

I can provide references if necessary, but 1. there is CO2 build-up in clumped python egg clutches, demonstrated in Antaresia; and 2. there are several cues but mostly movement by a hatching egg, or sometimes the mother, or even vocalisations (in crocodilians) are the cues to hatching.

The primary cue to hatching is simply the developmental stage of the embryo. When it is ready, it will hatch. The poor seppos have a problem with hatching because many collections hold animals of inferior (weak) genetic composition, as seen in these albino pythons.

Ive incubated eggs in a pure O2 environment (out of curiosity) and they hatched at the same time as those in a normal air mixture. Its not quite the result I was expecting or hoping for.

I also agree with the last sentiment. Let the weak die so that only the strong remain. Chosing when to interveine (as we have to at some stage) can make all the difference.

 

[BROWNS]

Can see the egg tooth in the 3rd and 4th large closeup pics......can you see it?

As I mentioned earlier and as others have stated the same that mum knows best and if the eggs are pipped to this degree the chances of weaker animals hatching is better hence out comes a snake that in the wild would not have hatched.If this was a genetic flaw it would be passed on to future offspring bringing weaker animals into the hobby the same way as I stated about no egg teeth if it was also a genetic flaw.I have a hide heat box similar to Solars and this makes the female lay the eggs in a clump with her coiled around the eggs but I left the female to incubate them,all hatched bar 1 which had and still has me baffled.

 

[JasonL]

JasonL: "only the strongest survive process", take this away and your weakening the hobby to line your pockets. Thats not a fair statement to make. Albinos are not weak. I have seen no difference in their maintenance compared to their wild type counterparts.

Albino's not weak eh? Ok...sure, are you talking about all albinos as a blanket statement, or just a percentage of them?... By the way, I never mentioned albinos, I was just referring to captive bred snakes in general, which on a percentage basis are weaker than their wild counterparts that have to undergo a survival of the fittest process to reach breeding age, cuttting the eggs open just weakens the already weak process we as breeders put them through.

 

[Serpentes]

Ive incubated eggs in a pure O2 environment (out of curiosity) and they hatched at the same time as those in a normal air mixture. Its not quite the result I was expecting or hoping for.

Cool. How did you manage that? I guess a bit of carbosorb filtering will get rid of CO2, but otherwise I guess you just regulated an in-line with oxygen? From what I understand there is a fair range of tolerance to gaseous environments in egg incubation. It also seems that the hydric environment is not as important as we like to think, as long as the substrate holds at least some water available for uptake.


CarpetPythons: I said that albino snakes are weak. It is generally the case. I can perhaps find some supporting documentation if this is thought of as a radical statement

 

[CarpetPythons.com.au]

Here we go again. I am going to agree to disagree with you.

 

[Just_Joshin]

Here we go again. I am going to agree to disagree with you.

[video=youtube;oKTiwCez6Zs]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oKTiwCez6Zs]YouTube - Whitesnake - Here I Go Again[/url][URL="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oKTiwCez6Zs[/video]

 

[CarpetPythons.com.au]

I am not interested in supporting documentation with this one. I am interested in your personal experience with albinos in your care?

 

[CodeRed]

Cool. How did you manage that? I guess a bit of carbosorb filtering will get rid of CO2, but otherwise I guess you just regulated an in-line with oxygen? From what I understand there is a fair range of tolerance to gaseous environments in egg incubation. It also seems that the hydric environment is not as important as we like to think, as long as the substrate holds at least some water available for uptake.


CarpetPythons: I said that albino snakes are weak. It is generally the case. I can perhaps find some supporting documentation if this is thought of as a radical statement

Easy, I drilled 2 holes in the tub. In one hole I placed the gas line from an oxy bottle. Open the tap for a couple of seconds, then seal both holes. I refilled the tub every couple of days just in case there were any leaks. It wasnt perfect, but the best I could do with the equipment I had. A better model would fit a pair connections to the tub. One in and the other out. Just gotta be careful not to explode the tub.

 

[zulu]

re These

Looked like they are ready,come on guys poke your heads out ,want to see what the patterns look like, little bit of this an a little bit of that,trah lah lah :lol:

 

[BROWNS]

Well I know my albino is one of theeasiest snakes to care for,he eats with no hesitation every time,is placid as can be and all round a hardy animal which has never had any problems whatsoever,it is just a carpet lacking pigmentation.There have been many wild caught albinos of breeding size and age so they survived the survival of the fittest test.Most of the morphs we know of originated from wild caught specimens here in OZ and in several places across the big pond.

 

[BROWNS]

Here's something different and interesting.I know a guy who hatches out all females in every species he breeds,most people will say he's not sexing them properly however he is quite experienced in that department and he knows exactly when they'll hatch down to the day!!

 

[Serpentes]

I am not interested in supporting documentation with this one. I am interested in your personal experience with albinos in your care?

I don't keep colour pattern mutants, so my experience will be fairly uninteresting even to the most interested! I will refrain from referencing the below prose, to align with your interests.

For many species the breeding of albino snakes results in high egg mortality in the F2 generation (F1 doesn't produce albinos). This happens even in corn snakes, the greatest mutants of them all, or at least it did in 1959 when the first albinos were bred in number at Balimore Zoo. After successive generations in captivity (required to reach an F3 offspring) there is artifical selection that ensures captive representation of the mutant gene. It is not only the reduced hatching rate inherent to the F2 generation (up to 50%, plus neonatal mortality), but the inbreeding of albino lines (desirable if you want to get more albino snakes) that causes idiosyncratic hatching problems with albinos. The mutation responsible for albinism is variable within species and has greater effect in some than in others.

Given your propensity to pip your albino eggs you are familiar with this phenomenon?

 

[CarpetPythons.com.au]

I am not going to argue about this. I pip them because I want to pip them. I will go and take some pictures after dinner.

 

[Serpentes]

I'm not prepared to argue either, but I do foster intelligent and informed dialogue without emotive reactions. I already know why you pip your eggs, it's because you want them to hatch and survive, rather than a naiive "because I want to" as proffered above I in no way intend on debasing your skill with these eggs, so please don't act so scared!

Easy, I drilled 2 holes in the tub. In one hole I placed the gas line from an oxy bottle. Open the tap for a couple of seconds, then seal both holes. I refilled the tub every couple of days just in case there were any leaks. It wasnt perfect, but the best I could do with the equipment I had. A better model would fit a pair connections to the tub. One in and the other out. Just gotta be careful not to explode the tub.

Not perfect but it would displace a lot of nitrogen at least. It's a very interesting observation. I've removed CO2 from eggs but not nitrogen, which is the main gas in air. Removing CO2 (using carbosorb) had no effect on hatching in the skinks I trialled.

 

[wranga]

for the knockers of CarpetPythons method, why do you artificially incubate your eggs instead of leaving them with mum for maternal incubation? would it be to get a higher hatch rate? so CarpetPythons method of pipping her eggs is to get a higher hatch rate. so IMO her method is no different to yours except she has an extra step in her method. im enjoying this thread and cant wait for these eggs to hatch and see the results that CarpetPythons gets with this method

 

[CodeRed]

I'm not prepared to argue either, but I do foster intelligent and informed dialogue without emotive reactions. I already know why you pip your eggs, it's because you want them to hatch and survive, rather than a naiive "because I want to" as proffered above



Not perfect but it would displace a lot of nitrogen at least. It's a very interesting observation. I've removed CO2 from eggs but not nitrogen, which is the main gas in air. Removing CO2 (using carbosorb) had no effect on hatching in the skinks I trialled.

Yeah I know it wasnt perfect, but it had to be done. Maybe this year I might inject a bit of CO2 into a tub say a week prior to the expected pip date and see if it induces hatching.

 

[firedream]

well said wranga! couldn't agree more.

 

[zobo]

my Darwin clutch just started coming out naturally and so far 4 heads all out within hours of each other.

Interesting thing is; even though they have been at 31 degrees it still took 63 days.

j

 

[Chrisreptile]

Here's something different and interesting.I know a guy who hatches out all females in every species he breeds,most people will say he's not sexing them properly however he is quite experienced in that department and he knows exactly when they'll hatch down to the day!!

Could you elaborate more on that?

Does he incubate at a different temperature? etc