useing a glove to get snake out

[Bluetongue1]

….I am pretty much a complete newbie to all of this and when i first joined this forum the very first post i made i got a rude comment as a reply and almost completely gave up right then and there. The only thing that saved me and my love towards my new hobby is that i had a good friend that i leant on for info and he was fantastic!
Everyone needs to remember that others may not be as fortunate as i was and one rude comment could turn a newbie off the hobby before they really begin!

One has to wonder why this happens when Site Rule No.1 states: “Be nice to other members”. I have watched what happens and given it a good deal of thought. What is very clear is that in every case someone makes a negative comment (either directly or indirectly) about another member in relation to their post. This opens the door for a retort, in kind, and away we go….

Some members feel compelled to come to the defence of others and so get drawn into the conflict. Some act like ‘vultures’ waiting and ready to pounce for their pound of flesh. Whatever the reason for getting involved, people would not do so if it did not get personal in the first place. So no matter how justified you feel in passing even a small comment about the poster, DON’T!!!

APS should be a pleasant place to spend time pursuing our interests and interacting with like-minded people. Not a place where you have to sit through people being rude and arrogant while they indulge in name smearing and / or character assassination. To this end, I would like to suggest a more pragmatic approach to Site Rule No.1. I know from experience that if you adhere to it, it works….

ATTACK THE POST, NEVER THE POSTER!

Blue

Bluetongue1 - Read the first 2 pages of this post and see if you find it amusing?

Maybe I got it wrong but if that is what rings your bell then perhaps a ticket ringside would a better investment of time that this forum.

Blue

 

[Illusive_Jag]

Blue you summed it up perfect in your above 3 paragraphs. As i pointed out i found it amusing in regards to peoples responses.

End of the day ya cant take the fear out of a newbie, merely encourage better techniques, so they can enjoy and respect the animal.

This is the word for today..

Got my ticket to the Tiddlywinks Vs Twinkletoes 2011 all stars forum tickle comp.

Cheers for the advice Blue.

 

[alrightknight]

"I know some keepers with quite large collections who still use gloves because they say their snakes bite them. Or, they don’t have the confidence to handle some of their snakes at all. In my view, with a few tricks of the trade described here, this is totally unnecessary and is more a reflection of their handling skills than their herps unusual behaviour. Mind you, if you handle your snakes badly and teach them to be anxious around you, they can become pretty nasty. It has been said that you can learn a lot about a keeper from the way their snakes behave!" - doc roc.

Untitled Document

Sorry not suggesting that anyone here mistreats there snakes at all. More so pointing out the fact that using gloves means your not all that confident handling snakes haha.

 

[Bluetongue1]

More so pointing out the fact that using gloves means your not all that confident handling snakes haha.

That is one sweeping generalisation you are making. Would you care to provide the evidence to support it. There a number of glove wearers who have experience and have indicated why they wear gloves and most did not say it was because they are not confident in handling their snakes. Or do you simply disbelieve all of them? Ahh, I think I know what it is - perhaps you didn’t read those posts. Yeah. That would do it!

Sarcasm is not nice and I apologise to you for using it. However, I wished to illustrate the effect that your comment potentially has on anyone who said they wear gloves.

The issue in this thread is not about handling confidence. It is about doing what works to produce a calm response from your snake(s) when removed and handled.

I have deliberately been bitten by a mate’s hatchy carpet. He wanted to demonstrate to me that it did not hurt, which it didn’t. Nor did I flinch when he tagged me. Being bitten by a small python is not the least bit frightening to me. However, when I take a hatchy out of its container I do not want to be bitten. A couple of months back I demonstrated to a friend how to take her snappy little stimmie out without being bitten. She was surprised that it could be done but by following some simple techniques the snake settled down fairly quickly. And that is what is the ultimate goal.

No-one minds you expressing an opinion, but when it contradicts the facts already given, don’t expect it to be warmly welcomed.

Blue

 

[Suenstu]

Good on ya Blue. I think you've hit the proverbial nail on the proverbial head. At times it appears almost a "pack" mentality on APS, which is a definite shame as it could be an encouraging rich resource for so many people who have a mutual interest.
Why bother with in-fighting? Don't we face enough difficulty with "main stream"? By all means, express your opinion, and no-one is going to agree with everyone all of the time (how boring would THAT be?), but maybe do the old think before you post? Totally agree with Blue's point - attack the post, not the poster, and perhaps we will alleviate some of this negativity and anger?
Hey guys, Have a great night!

 

[alrightknight]

Blue I realise where you are coming from, but after reading this just about every post from people who wear gloves have stated they do so because they are scared, and if you are regarding my quote, I just wanted to add some input from a respected professionals point of view.

hi every one i know alot of people will probly have a lot of bad coments to this but i was woundering how many people use a glove to get ther snake out of the enclsoure i started a while ago coz my coastal was looking like it wanted to bite me he is not very big but is my first snake so was a bit nerves

Nerves come from a lack of confidence, the reason he uses gloves was because he was nervous and not confident at the start, and now wants to know if its soemthign people normally do, which those who have responded have mostly said its because they are scared or have an aggressive animal. So yes it reflects handler confidence a lot. so my apologies I realise I generalised all but I by far did not mean to.

I havent said using gloves is wrong, just means you have at one point or still do lack some confidence in handling a snake.

So Im confident my opinion still stands and does not contradict any facts given.

 

[aspidito]

ok to all the people out ther having a go at me i am more than capable of not hurting my snake with a glove on and i also said it makes the snake feel more relaxed when i use a glove after i have picked it up i take the glove off and handle it so the snake is still getting the smell of me i dont know y so many people have to be so negative to another persons way of handling a few people have said they use gloves and to say that that is wrong and they are giving bad info is not fair and to every one who has stood up for me in some way i thank you

Mate you are spot on........I have a 7 foot female Darwin that I call the bitch for obvious reasons, if you touch her in her enclosure with bare hands she goes ballistic & believe me I have been around long enough to have used the bag method.
She is reacting to the sense of feeling a living warm blooded hand trying to secure her in her domain! & she is doing everything for protection & to try & get away which also includes striking.
Easy method is to use gloves & a hook & she is able to be picked out without too much drama, once out of the enclosure I flick off one glove & swap hands & when she is OK with that flick off the other glove say a prayer & that is her therapy for the week!
If you do that she will get used to your feel & scent, dont let other people put you off, there are some nutters on here but there are also some very experienced herpers that will offer good advice.

 

[Bluetongue1]

Can't understand why people suggest that with using a glove you can't tell how much pressure you are exerting on the snake.
Hello,haaello, I work in leather gloves most days doing at times some fairly delicate tasks, never had a problem…

I am glad someone with lots of experience can attest to that. You lose a measure of the sensitivity of your touch – not the whole lot. In picking up even a hatchy you can still feel what you are doing. You will also be using your eyes and the snake will very quickly let you know if it is being impeded, let alone squeezed, or worse, in pain. Handling is straight forward and the same applies. Wearing gloves alone is not going to result in someone damaging a python when handling – an incorrect claim!

Blue

 

[The Devil]

Looking at the way this thread has gone I'm glad that mammion90 didn't ask for advise about something that could be considered controversial.

I'm a GLOVER and not ashamed to admit it.

I even use a glove when helping to sex baby jungles. I hold them and a mate sexes them. Baby jungle are snappy and without a glove each would bite 3 or 4 times.
Multiply that by 20 or 30 and that's a lot of little bites, not a great deal of blood but a lot of itching.
With a glove they might try and bite once.
I'm pretty sure that I haven't damaged any over the 12 years or so I've been doing this.

I'm long past the stage of needing to prove how tough I am or how confident I am in handling snakes.

Us a glove, towel, bag, hook or whatever.
Is there any definite rule as to how snakes are to be removed from cages.

Use or do whatever works for you and you're happy with.

 

[-Peter]

If it makes you feel more secure and relaxed and it isn't detrimental to herps then whatever you want to do. This topic was one of the earliest ever on this site.

 

[SYNeR]

I've found if I approach my snakes with a flat hand (as opposed to an object they can actually bite / grab on to), it just seems to confuse the hell out of them and they don't bother striking..

 

[Tristan]

wait I'm confused, how do people think that cotton gloves are any form of protection? snake teeth are thin and sharp they will go straight through cotton, and then wouldn't you have the possible issue of the teeth getting caught in the cotton?

i don't use gloves but my snake has never had a go at me and if it does ill take the hit hope for blood and show you all some picks and become a member of the bitten club.

leather gloves i can see would provide you with some protection but how strong are snakes teeth is there a risk to the teeth snapping on leather?

people saying that wearing gloves and pulling back is dangerous....well your correct you can damage the animal but you can do the same thing with your bare hand so i don't see how its a valid arguing point for either side of the debate.

pretty much I'm up for what ever helps keepers build there confidence as long as it does not damage or impact the health/safety of both keeper and kept (kept being the snakes )

are any of the arguments against gloves based on facts or is it conjecture and hearsay? genuine question i mean has any one seen or done any tests to know any definitive facts about this?

personally, i just make sure the snake is aware of my presence IE i make sure its awake and has seen me before i attempt to touch it, and i use bare hands.

 

[Bluetongue1]

Blue you summed it up perfect in your above 3 paragraphs. As i pointed out i found it amusing in regards to peoples responses.

End of the day ya cant take the fear out of a newbie, merely encourage better techniques, so they can enjoy and respect the animal.

This is the word for today..

Got my ticket to the Tiddlywinks Vs Twinkletoes 2011 all stars forum tickle comp.

Cheers for the advice Blue.

You’ll have to forgive me on that one. I consider the bickering to be a major let down of APS. I realise if you stand back and watch these sorts of proceedings it can be rather laughable. However, I have seen people get hurt to the point where they left APS permanently. And although this spat wasn’t was not that bad, you can get some very nasty all-in bun fights that serve no-one in a positive manner.

Thank you for taking my criticism the right way and I loved your sense of humour displayed. You could say I fell of the soapbox laughing.

Cheers
Blue

 

[Chris1]

to all the people saying get a lizard, have you ever been bitten by a lizard?
my male beardy got spooked when i chased him in the yard a while ago (a plane went over and he bolted, so i had to chase him) and almost took my thumb off, went right thru to the bone 3 seperate times before i could get it out and took abotu 6 weeks to heal. (scars are still visible 2 years on).

i would rather rub myself in rat and play with my snakes that have that happen again!

i dont use gloves, but i do pull my jumper over my hands when im getting my jungles out, why? cos they only bother striking when they see flesh,...

just cos someone uses gloves doesnt mean they have the reaction of pulling back, i lost that a long time ago, but still dont plan on losing blood everytime i approach my jungles.

each to their own i say!!!

 

[Bluetongue1]

I am with you, Chris!

I have this inexplicable aversion for pain. And I am not terribly keen on the sight of blood, either. Particularly mine! Weird, I know. But as hard as I try to get into this masochism thing, I just chicken out every time. Cunningham skinks really hurt as well. The little blighters seem to hang on forever. Cop a bite from a large mother and it’s enough to wipe the smile of the toughest dial. The claws on lacies and some of the other monitors can also make a nice mess of you. As for being bitten by one… I don’t even want to go there.


Basically that was quite a rude comment to be made as it belittles what others in the hobby are trying to achieve, are seeking to improve on or are already successfully doing. The macho approach to snake taming might get you to where you want to go. But that does not mean it is the only way or that it is the best way. I liken it the days of teaching spelling with a stick – you got a cut of the cane for every word you spelt wrong. Effective? Yes. Appropriate? ….

Blue

 

[TurboMoped]

If you feel you need gloves, wear gloves. It's not going to hurt your snake.

There are obviously a few people on here who have never had the pleasure of being bitten by a 10 foot coastal with an attitude or an olive who decides your hand looks like dinner.