It's all in the colour

[Mitchie]

well red-ink I grew up fascinated by snakes, pythons, reptiles, etc.. so if there was some crazy purple, green and white patterned snake that lived in Australia endemically!! Yes I would be amazed at it's natural beauty and buy one.

I think it's weird that people want to screw around with genetic's purely for look's.. It's vein!
Mess with genetic's for productive purposes not pointless money driven one's
If you like hybrids so much move to America! Keep Australia pure off mutations!!!

 

[Morelia4life]

Ty Bump I am a bit out of the picture in Aus now

Ok cool ^^^Morelia
Did the first signs of neuro damage in USA come from the supposedly original batch of jags from Sweden
Or did it surface after the irian jayas were introduced into the mix??

Just wondering if mixing in a gene pool from a definitely tropical area with subtropical genes may have something to do with it???

I know little about jags except that they are beautiful but have shown signs of too many problems
[bit like my ex really]

I couldn't even tell you that to be honest. Over here, we have Coastal Jags, Irian Jaya jags, Bredli Jags, Jungle jags, and Diamond Jungle jags. All I know is that the first jags were brought over in 1994 and they were proven out in 1998. For all I know, the parents could have had the neuro genes and passed them onto the first clutch of jags and it all started from there. I believe that the first jags hatched out from normal looking parents, if I am not mistaken.

 

[Red-Ink]

Still Mitchie (and I'm not having a go).... What is a natural beauty by your standards growing up with the fascination with them as that was not answered in your post.

 

[Fantazmic]

The whole thoroughbred dog argument is not really a good one as thoroughbred dogs on a whole have more problems than jags. Just a few examples are rollies, are predisposed to cancer and usually die very young, pugs, all sorts of eye and breathing problems, ragdoll cats have all sorts of problems bred into them to make them 'floppy' and the list goes on. What is a good thing for reptiles is the exact opposite in many cases for dogs and cats.

Having bred throughbred Staffordshire Bull Terriers for the last 10 years and mixed with a lot of breeders and 'know' the industry inside out...this post is really uninformed....

 

[dihsmaj]

I checked out another forum, looked at the 'Morelia carinata' subforum, and had a look at some picc in a few threads.
I saw one post from a man in Michigan 'Give me a corn snake over a Roughie anyday'. I then read another one, 'I'll get one, but only when the Jaguar gene is in it.'
It really is all in the colour...

Found both the quotes, they're by the same person:

quote 1:
A very over rated snake due to rarity value. Give me a corn snake any day!
quote 2:
'I think carinata should be very interesting snake once crossed with GTP's, boelens and the zebra and jaguar genes!'

These are BOTH talking about the RSP, but it's also about people wanting better looking snakes.

Enjoy the little things.

 

[KaotikJezta]

Having bred throughbred Staffordshire Bull Terriers for the last 10 years and mixed with a lot of breeders and 'know' the industry inside out...this post is really uninformed....

Did I say anything about Bull Terriers. I used to breed cats and also know a lot of dog and cat breeders, and I never once said all breeds, I said there are definitely breeds that have very bad traits bred into them.

 

[Fantazmic]

Assessing the looks, handling, "personality", whatever, ....... that's all good if you're buying a reptile form a local breeder (and he/she lets you to go all over the animal). What should people look for or how should they go about selecting a snake say from Pilbara Pythons or from me?

Michael when i first bought my jungles I was so scared to import anything I found a local breeder. I actually bought for temperament. I didnt get to hold the snake the breeder did that in front of me and I just watched Elvira and she seemed curious and calm and so I picked her. Having been a breeder myself (of staffies) the way the snakes were kept was also important I wanted to buy from someone ethical. A few months ago I bought from QLD I was so nervous about what I was being sent but I have to say that the breeder was so ethical what he said I would get I got and so I would import again. As to questions about clutch size etc I didnt ask them because I havent even really thought about breeding...well maybe a tiny bit....it was more knowing that they are healthy etc that meant something to me

 

[Mitchie]

That's fine Red-Ink no offence taken, just got a bit carried away because I feel this is an important topic to debate . Natural beauty to me is anything in nature that is amazing and stunning without genetic alteration,
because it obviously isn't natural for humans to force different species of python to breed with each other. I am really interested in the behaviour of pythons also, not just the looks.

Sorry if I'm going on a bit lol. Please tell me if you think I'am wrong.

 

[Jay84]

Having bred throughbred Staffordshire Bull Terriers for the last 10 years and mixed with a lot of breeders and 'know' the industry inside out...this post is really uninformed....

We all know that lots of purebred dogs suffer ailments due to their breeding for certain traits. This is no secret.

You only have to look in any dog breed book for it to list all the ailments commonly found in each breed. You only have to watch any of the Vet TV shows to get a small insight.

 

[D3pro]

We all know that lots of purebred dogs suffer ailments due to their breeding for certain traits. This is no secret.

You only have to look in any dog breed book for it to list all the ailments commonly found in each breed.

+1 many vets will confirm this. quite sad

 

[kawasakirider]

Is the comment in this thread about long haired rotties being knocked off at birth true? That is so horrid

Cocker spaniels are bred for red coats, but it's linked to an aggressive dog, lol.

 

[Waterrat]

WOW.......
This is the best topic to come up in a long time.

Without knowing the details of a proposed "breeder" certification (if that is what it is?)......not much to add,
except that in order to certify I imagine microchipping would be part of the process along with visual and dna testing?

As you said, lets not jump the gut, no one has got any information so far to form an opinion.
Microchipping is DEFINITELY not on! Subcutaneous pit tagging is useless, the tag can be easily removed, that's apart from the aesthetics, and internal microchipping requires surgery under LA - who would pay for it?

 

[Morelia4life]

I don't know about you guys, but I would take my snake out of any ball python cross.

 

[Wookie]

I don't know about you guys, but I would take my snake out of any ball python cross.

View attachment 196523View attachment 196524

Very, erm...natural snake you have there :lol:

 

[Jay84]

I don't know about you guys, but I would take my snake out of any ball python cross.

View attachment 196523View attachment 196524

Wow.... what a perfect example of a 'wild type' morelia there hahahaha.

I think your argument now is null and void lol

 

[Morelia4life]

Wow.... what a perfect example of a 'wild type' morelia there hahahaha.

I think your argument now is null and void lol

I didn't do it to show that is was a wild type morelia...... any one with half a brain will know a coastal jag isn't from the wild.
I was just showing it because I like carpets and I would take any carpet over any ball python morph or ball python hybrid.
Also, I am not arguing with anyone so I don't know where that came from. I just can't stand ball pythons and I think there are
so many other snakes that are better than them. To me, they are boring, ugly, dull, non interactive, some can be picky eaters, they don't get large enough, so on and so on.

 

[fugawi]

Haven't looked at this for a while, so many new views.

It is interesting to see that MOST Aussies seem to have more ethics and morals when it comes to Xs and Jags compared to our international counterparts. Just simply the fact that we are debating this shows we won't go down the same path.

With Dogs, you can't use them as any type of example due to the fact they have been cross and interbred over thousands of years, except to show "what might happen if.... " Just crossing two Morelias to get a Jag has shown up neurological problems, what will show up in unlike species crosses?

With pedigree, I think going locale specific is a bit too far, a Morelia SpilotaSpilota, whether it comes from nth or sth of Sydney is still a Diamond Python. You could always put locales in the family tree part anyway ( but it would be purely trust).

On mentioning RSPs, (slightly unrelated) How do Americans have RSPs in their collection anyway? Would these not be, by definition, illegal exports from Australia?

 

[Morelia4life]

I heard there are a few people over here with RSP. I don't know how true it is though. I heard something like they are on a loan???

 

[Elapidae1]

Yep if they were 20 grand here imagine what the price would have been to sneak one out.

 

[Jay84]

I didn't do it to show that is was a wild type morelia...... any one with half a brain will know a coastal jag isn't from the wild.
I was just showing it because I like carpets and I would take any carpet over any ball python morph or ball python hybrid.
Also, I am not arguing with anyone so I don't know where that came from. I just can't stand ball pythons and I think there are
so many other snakes that are better than them. To me, they are boring, ugly, dull, non interactive, some can be picky eaters, they don't get large enough, so on and so on.

This thread isn't about ball pythons.... it is about liking snakes for their colour etc. You have chosen a morelia morph over a wild type/ locality animal.